bill: well done, paul..% thank you. we're looking forward to the next nine, ten days in your country in south africa. martha? martha: well, now for more on nelson mandela, let's wring in a man who brings a unique perspective to this discussion because he was the u.s. ambassador to south africa during apartheid. edward perkins, former u.s. ambassador to south africa, ambassador, welcome. it is very good to have you with us this morning. >> thank you. good to be here. martha: look back for us on those times in the reagan administration and the role, the unique role that you were asked to play while nelson mandela was in prison prison. >> well, as you say, during the reagan administration things got a little hot here in washington, in the united states in terms of how the united states government looked at the apartheid system. and we were sort of using benign neglect in a sense. not getting directly involved in letting everybody know that this was not something that the united states government could countenance. and pres